bruce ~ is ~ original

OK, now off to find my dictionary.

derisive confusion


or


Dutch oven

As an aside, the use of "~" was learned from sawyer.

I'm still wondering if SoulBoogieAlex is a second or third generation fan.

Post deleted by smokeyjoe

So you're saying he's both second and third generation?

I was still in diapers when Bruce hit the Hammersmith stage for the first time, you do the math

Bruce certainly is an original, but nothing is created in a vacuum. Nobody can deny that Springsteen draws heavily on R&R's past. Tracing that past can be interesting even though it takes just a tad more effort than coming up the next cynical remark.

Good post. I can read you better at under 100 words.

I think Bruce was less influenced at critical points in his direction by the artists and performers that he liked, but more by the ballads and jams of the time, which he transformed into drug-free shore rock and roll. Later on, the emotional pain of his lawsuit was a big influence, which gave us Darkness. After that, Mr. Krabs Jon Landau influenced his career and not much else.

Hammersmith was '76 right? Due to bedwetting brought on by being continuously bullied at school, I'm guessing you were in diapers up to the age of 14. That makes you 2nd generation.

I'm curious to what ballads and jams you are referring to. Seems to me the early seventies had little to offer for an artist that's just oozing the classics of the genre.

I think people in general give Landau too much credit, much of Born To Run had taken shape before Landau even stepped to the plate. Landau was never credited as a co-author, as a producer his role was naturally limited to being a critical ear.

I was saying Landau's influence kicked in hard for the River.

As for ballads and jams, I'm referring to the star bands of the age.... dead, hendrix, floyd, yes, who were into the acid rock jams and using an album as a tale.

This is all very OAN. Impressive.

Three acts who were past their prime or dead when Springsteen had yet to set foot in the studio, I'd take that as a stretch to call to call them current. Besides Pink Floyd and the Dead making music of a totally different nature of course. Even though Floyd had a short resurgence when Springsteen released his first album, he never had much to do with acid rock. The first two albums were Dylan, Van and Chuck stirred together. I wonder if Bruce was even aware of the Dead at the time.

All to easy, but I think old age is slowly eating away your memory

Post deleted by smokeyjoe

Oh, and Zeppelin was doing the acid rock thing at the same time too. And the first two albums were pure Bruce, nobody else.

I gotta say that the first two were rather "Dylan". And BTR was rather "Phil Spector" (wall o sound).

I think Bruce found his "voice" (whathaveyou) with Darkness. In no other time was Bruce so sure of who he was, and what he wanted to be. It shaped him personally and his music down to the core (bless that nasty lawsuit).

SoulBoogieAlex may be a bit verbose, but at least he has something to say.

That hurts. And yeah, I read the whole Dylan, Van, Chuck thing on Wiki, too. Deep.

The mods should put this in OAN if they were actually up to doing their job rather than locking threads and changing titles.

Done.

we're not here as much as some.

Springsteen is an original because he's a jack-of-all-trades.

He'll go down in the history books as The Greatest Utility Man in Rock History: The uber-fan who loved his idols so much, he honored them by taking their music to new heights.

Has smokeyjoe opened up a new wormhole on the board? Post on a thread in one forum (general), and have it show up in another forum (OAN). Well done. dt never came up with that on.

When a thread is moved the old thread stays until someone posts again in that forum.

what is a third or second generation fan?

Agree to some extent, Zep was a big influence on his career before the E-Street Band, but I'd say he only dabbled in that Supergroup stuff. If I'd want to call Zep acid rock, I doubt it.

Descending talk for people who didn't get totally plastered at an '78 show at least.

I agree, all though I do feel that Nebraska album is one other moment where everything just fell together, even though he wasn't sure enough of himself to take it on the road solo and acoustic.

Oddly enough the Recent Seeger Session comes close in terms of finding his voice. No other Springsteen album sounds quite so relaxed, part of the live recordings and minimum overdubs, and so diverse yet cohesive on an album. I would have loved to see that happen on an ESB album. The River came close to that feel, but no cigar.

Obviously.

Cream was more of an influence than Zep.

First Generation Fan- Pre-Born to Run.
Second Generation Fan- Born to Run-Nebraska.
Third Generaton Fan- BIUSA-Joad.
Fourth Generation Fan- Reunion to present.

Led Zeppelin? Cream? Any music?

The only things that Steel Mill outfit was influenced by were mudslides and gorilla mating calls.

you say that like it's a bad thing.

The Seeger Sessions was just a well produced "jam-session", not much more. It did showcase what a "loose" Bruce would be like on an album (as his recording history dictates, he was always quite anal during the process otherwise). Bruce just happened to collect a number of talented musicians, some light-hearted (yet meaningful) material (that he was not so personally attached to), a producer that brought it all together, and some incredible recording techniques, and just "threw it out there". I dont think he thought it was going to be a real commercial success, or that the fan-base would accept it as much as the Euros did. He just had him some fun.

Now, your comment on Nebraska...

I think what happened with that recording is that Bruce was conflicted with his direction for the very first time in his career. He had always been in a band up to that point, and yet there was this desire to do solo work (as he had done for his John Hammond demos). I figure he always looked back at that event and wondered "What if..." if he had taken Hammond's vision literally (solo act). Nebraska (even though it started out as a collection of demos for the next "band" album) was the start of him venturing out in that direction. Testing the waters, if you will.

The Ghost Of Tom Joad, and subsequently Devils & Dust, and to a lesser yet relevant extent Tunnel, support this "split Bruce" theory. Since Nebraska, Bruce has released a solo, then a band, then a solo, then a band, etc release. According to US magazine, when he was suffering from writers block (and subsequently fired the E Street Band, released Lucky & Human), he was also suffering from a "split personality disorder of some kind. (I dont know about that... consider the source). However, it would explain (to some extent) what my point is.

The River was a mess. It should never have been 2 albums. Bruce was a writing machine and that got in the way of the production of the project. It represents what an album would sound like when Bruce is distracted, or his attention span is that of a 5 year old. Judging by all the outtakes from those sessions (the ones circulating anyway), a much better, tighter album SHOULD have been released. Hidesight is 20/20, I guess.

My 2 cents.

That is an interesting point, but I would say that The River is supposed to be all over the place.

Remember, Springsteen wanted to release an album that played like a slice of life. He wanted it to be a hodge-podge, and his selection of 'The River' as the album's title lends creedence to the idea that he wanted to emphasize the ebb and flow of his moods and to see if he could make sense of everyday life by representing it through all different types of music and characters, no matter where it took him.

Again, I could be wrong, but this is the way I always viewed it. I think after the thematic tightness of BTR and Darkness, Bruce wanted to let everyone knew he was still a musician first, and an artist second.

In my mind, those terms are not mutually exclusive. My definition of a musician includes being an artist, in fact, it's the litmus test to quantify quality. Someone just playing notes as written is just a technician, however proficient they may be.

I agree that the terms are definitely not mutually exclusive. I just think that Bruce wanted to re-emphasize his band's looseness and ability to play all types of music, rather than hone in on one particular feeling again, which would've been the result of releasing "The Ties That Bind.".

From here, it looks like The River was the point where he wanted to let everyone know that he was first a flannelled, everyday working class ''spokesman'' parody, then a musician second. But then of course, you could view it as an exercise for Nebraska.

The album reflects the ebb and flow of his live show.